Do you want to clean up Orble, rid it of filth, depravity and profanity? - I do
December 26th 2006 07:44
Signature tune
We were asked our new Year's resolutions.
I realised, then, I had to do what I could to rid Orble of the serious pollution of our minds.
I have exercised some tolerance to see if the disgusting behaviour would work out its course.
Freedom of speech does not mean freedom to abuse. The female intelligence should be deeply offended and yet it remains quiet.
I am disgusted to see just how many males tolerate it as if it is a normal part of life. It is not, in my opinion, in any way normal.
I guess I'm going to 'cop' the usual amount of flack for expressing this point of view.
I am used to selecting men who do not abuse women in this way.
I feel sure there are males and females here who are as offended as I. I am shocked by the number of females who allow their sensitivities to be so blunted.
Such abuses are not signs of writing skill, they are signs of much deeper, more sinister things. They should not be tolerated.
Now, it is up to you. Either you agree or disagree but please don't regard this as an avenue to abuse me.
Let's stick to the point of the question.
I have never before been exposed to such 'muck', I am not going to put up with it any longer without attempting to do something about it.
Please join with me in answering the question. Because, I, for one, am going to endeavour to do something about it, cyberspace, or not!
Pedophiles prosper in such an environment, let us not support the type of licence that leads to abuse. Pollution of the mind is just as important as pollution of the environment.
May I have your opinions please?
| 228 |
| Vote |
Add To: 
subscribe to this blog
Comment by Ahmed
Video Gamer Kids
Little Green Foosballs
PolyKicks
I don't particularly like it on orble, but it hasn't reached nearly an epidemic yet. If it does then I'll be thinking of breaking off... techybits.com still isn't taken
But yeah I tolerate these things just like you, I tolerate a lot more in real life so this isn't much.
Comment by katyzzz
Photography Tips
MS Paint Art
I appreciate your giving your view and this practice is rather widespread in that it is always before our faces.
I hope Orble will ensure it stops.
katyzzz
Comment by Norm
Consumption Malfunction
Equal and Opposite
Arses and Elbows
Footy Power
There is a school of thought that says that Abstract Art is an abuse too.
Centuries of Artists devoting themselves to the visual world to create art that reflects that visual experience are polluted by the lazy meanderings of the hands of Abstract artists.
We could well ask for the removal of all non-representational art.
Norm.
I'M NOT, BY THE WAY.
Comment by TomN
Boat Heaven
Whenever I write about or praise women on my boating site my site is in comparison inundated.
Does this mean to be successful I should just spend my time writing about women being a success?
I think one guy in particular is having sex for the first time in ages and is just mad about it and that is that. As for witing hard or soft porn I have a goal to be Australia's best erotic writer. many people still think that erotic has to be some kind of porn. No!
Cheers
TomN
Comment by Ahmed
Video Gamer Kids
Little Green Foosballs
PolyKicks
When it comes to more sensitive things (namely some random photographer artist who took pictures of her *naked* kids) I don't accept it and won't accept their existence for the sake of art or not, since that kind of thing is abused by other people as erm.. child porn I guess.
Comment by katyzzz
Photography Tips
MS Paint Art
You've rather missed the point, eroticism is different. I am talking about "filth", there is nothing desirable about what we are being exposed to.
Norm ,you're comments are facetious and not in any way helpful. There's plenty of filth sites on the web, which I do not access and have a choice not to.
Here it is almost compulsory filth, and you're all going to learn the hard way.
I am trying to do something constructive about it.
Would you write such stuff, I doubt it. Get real, this is a serious issue, very offensive to most women, and the same for many men.
Condoning it will only attract more of it, if Orble wants to be known as such a place, it should declare its intentions.
This is a very serious issue, open your eyes, witness what you see and think about where it is all heading and whence it came. You can both do much better than that.
What goes on in your private life is your own business, don't force me to watch.
katyzzz
Comment by Norm
Consumption Malfunction
Equal and Opposite
Arses and Elbows
Footy Power
Did you know that the people who campaigned against Michelangelo's great Last Judgement had clothes painted on his naked figures to hide their humanity, their depravity?
Katyzz,
I find it contradictory to freely draw what you want with a line and colour, yet don't allow others the same freedom with their words.
Norm
Comment by Ahmed
Video Gamer Kids
Little Green Foosballs
PolyKicks
ANyways katyzz has a point about it, naked people are offending, squigly lines hardly are, besides bigger sites (namely digg.com, and some others) don't allow pornography at all becuase well... it degenerates the site commuinity. If orble keeps going that way it will suck badly in the end.
Still a nice way to attract readers nodoubt... (*checks techbits.com, still free, no problem here)
Comment by Norm
Consumption Malfunction
Equal and Opposite
Arses and Elbows
Footy Power
Comment by Norm
Consumption Malfunction
Equal and Opposite
Arses and Elbows
Footy Power
Comment by Joe Blogg
Joe Blogg's Blog
manchesterunited
collingwoodfootballclub
So there was Ian, Greg, Trevor and the lesser known Sisteen.
Comment by Norm
Consumption Malfunction
Equal and Opposite
Arses and Elbows
Footy Power
Comment by The Voices in my Head
The Voices in my Head
I may be one of the Orblers who has offended you in the past. In all truth, I don't feel as though what I have written has been offensive in the slightest, except maybe for the blatant truth of it. I wrote a post recently about this very thing in a very tongue in cheek way and deleted it because I knew people would be offended by it.
However, that being said, I admire, truly, the manner in which you stand up for your beliefs. You know that you will be ripped apart for voicing them, yet, you do it anyways. That's some courage.
As for the filth on Orble, yes, even I, miss live, let live and let love rule girl herself, find some stuff to be repugnant.
I find one person to be rude, over or undersexed, I am not sure, uncouth, unimaginative and vulgar. I do not find any pleasure in reading any of their work and so I don't anymore.
I do wish that Orble would go back to not placing previews on the homepage. It would prevent said persons from getting their shock off by posting that sort of thing.
If you really want to clean up Orble, the best thing to do is not to bring attention to those posts. Visit well written posts. Write posts bringing attention to the artistic writing on Orble. I am trying to do more of these things as time permits. Stop visiting blogs that are habitually grotesque in their vulgarity.
Orble cannot truthfully do anything about all the vulgarity without seriously impeding on freedom of speech.
For example, the 'eat french bread' site had a post about the use of the 'c' word. It wasn't vulgar at all. It was very well written and made a point about the use of that word, itself, and not referring to anything in a sexual manner. If Orble posted rules stating that these words are off limits, etc. then a post like the one I have just described would not be permitted. What would be your solution in this situation?
Also, I completely agree with you that just because someone wants to write something offensive, for that purpose and no other, does not mean it should be protected under freedom of speech...however, where would the line be drawn if it isn't?
Interesting post, Katyzzz.
Voices~
Comment by katyzzz
Photography Tips
MS Paint Art
I have avoided things as you suggest but the particular matter in question is unavoidable because it offends by heading and introduction.
I thnk Orble can act, just as Ahmed suggests about Dig and I feel sure there are many such others, some sites don't accept anything without its being assessed first.
I've never in my life been exposed to the filth that is allowed here and freedom of expression is really just an excuse used to hide perversion.
We should have a choice about what we read and are exposed to. As I've already said some things here are becoming compulsory.
There are plenty of good discussions, well written, that do not resort to such measures. It is a sign of bad writing, not good writing.
We don't accept such things without classification elsewhere, why should we accept it in cyberspace?.
There is a difference between a good discussion and one whose main objective is filth.
We'll see what happens.
katyzzz
Comment by The Voices in my Head
The Voices in my Head
Looks like Orble is cleaning up as you suggested. I just read that one of the offending blogs has been shut down.
I agree with your points above, btw.
Voices~
Comment by katyzzz
Photography Tips
MS Paint Art
you're a real pal
katyzzz
Comment by postmoderncritic
Postmodern Critic
Relativity Watch
Padsoc
Which posts/blogs in particular do you find offensive? I have no idea what you have read and what you haven't, so please be specific.
Comment by Wendi
I don't always use profanities in my posts, but at times, I do and I'd hate to have them censored. For me, the use of occasional profanities in writing isn't perverse or obscene, it's a form of raw expression needed to cut to the chase of the emotion.
People are diverse. What some find beautiful, others find offensive. Such is the way and that will never change. If Orble became a site of cotton candy fluff writing because everyone's concerned about offending everyone else, then quite frankly, there'd be no point at all in exerting energy in the site.
I write of paranormal subjects often -- I'm sure there's a great percentage of the world who would find certain paranormal topics offensive - or worse yet, wrongly accuse them of being satanic. I've spotted Wiccan writers here... how many Christians find that offensive? But should they be censored? I don't think so.
I do lose much respect for writers who degrade themselves and their readers with obscene or perverse text. I've removed some authors from my favorites list for this very reason and refuse to read their posts. Still, I wouldn't suggest censorship as the first or only option.
We can't please everyone all of the time, and we can't sugar-coat reality and frost over truths for the sake of keeping a community sweet. As with anything in life, one must take the bad if one chooses to accept the good. Sex wouldn't sell if there wasn't a paying audience. We can't blame the writers whose vulgar posts make it to the top of the popularity chain. We are the ones who make them popular.
I do believe that where nudity or adult content are present, there should, however, be age requirements in joining the community. I don't believe children should have access to some of the more extreme posts.
Comment by Tracy
Movies and Life
Has that whole blog been closed down or just the offensive posts?
I have to say that haven't been enjoying this recent Orble war...
Tracy
Comment by The Daily Sonnet
The Daily Sonnet
Lots of Sonnets
Comment by Tracy
Movies and Life
I don't know what to think really. On one hand there's freedom of speech to consider (and respect) and then on the other hand it was turning into quite a verbal war.
Comment by Wendi
Whose blog goes next? What can or can't we say or write without being added to the chopping block?
:
It would have been so easy to just ignore the bad apples, but instead, we have to cut away portions of the community as if they're cancerous. Upsetting.
Comment by Damo
I left this advice on anyther post before the whole lot was deleted:
Orble has no R18 adult warning as people ebter the site. The front page displays images that are in the body of the posts. Any one who comes to the site cannot consent to seeing these images. There is no way of preventing children from viewing explicit material that they cannot pschologically process.
My final advice is that if someone is intentionally trying to be controversial to increase their audience it is self defeating from a technical standpoint. Firewall are designed pick up key offensive words and block the site. In otherwords they are design to kill you off from a potential reader.
Potentially they will block the entire orble site.
Comment by Luke
Old Movies
Cane Toad Warrior
Comment by katyzzz
Photography Tips
MS Paint Art
Apparently your sight is impaired also.
Keep your insults to yourself.
katyzzz
Comment by Luke
Old Movies
Cane Toad Warrior
Personally attacking someone because they attacked your weak argument is just a further sign of not being able to adequately express an opinion and falling prey to your own insecurity.
Comment by Adrian
Philosophy Blog
I'm on holiday at the moment, and don't know what you're talking about. So I'd agree with whoever above said that you should provide examples. I think this is the only way, ultimately, to sensibly discuss.
You raise a lot of things I'd like to respond to. But I just want to make quick comments on five of them.
1. You write "The female intelligence should be deeply offended and yet it remains quiet."
I personally think one should treat remarks about gender essentialism with caution...
Ie any remark that says "Girls should be/do x" and "Guys should be/do y".
The main reason to be cautious is that essentialism is usually false. Essentialist claims more proscribe than describe. They underestimate the effects of conditioning. And, to the extent that genetics applies, they underestimate the spectrum of different traits and abilities across the human race.
2. You write "I am disgusted to see just how many males tolerate it as if it is a normal part of life. It is not, in my opinion, in any way normal."
I also think one should be cautious about appeals to the normal. Normal is constantly changing, and norms differ wildly between cultures and times.
Furthermore, just because something is the case, doesn't mean it should be the case. Just because something is the status quo, doesn't mean it shouldn't be changed.
To put this another way: say that whatever you have in mind is not normal. Well, so what? If everything had to be constrained by the normal, then there would never be new ideas or improvement.
3. You write about pollution of minds.
The danger here is paternalism. Making people's decisions for them.
Isn't "pollution of minds" usually just an excuse to keep people ignorant? Don't you see the same rhetoric under any totalitarian regime?
Why should any ignorance be a good thing?
4. If you're saying "You should be free to say anything you like, as long as it doesn't offend me", then is it freedom at all?
Wouldn't you agree that freedom of speech is only meaningful for the hard cases?
Why isn't freedom of speech freedom to abuse? Why isn't ridicule a legitimate form of attack? If, for instance, people disagree with religion, or gun ownership, or your posts, may they not ridicule them? Would you have banned the Danish Mohammed cartoons?
Of course, you might be against freedom of speech (though you seem to be saying that you're in support of it). And what freedom of speech is and whether it should prevail is a whole nother debate...
5. Have you considered that you might be wrong about what's "perversion" / "disgusting behaviour" / "inappropriate" / "muck", etc and what's not?
Are you saying that your beliefs about perversion are obviously correct and that no reasonable person would disagree with you?
Frankly, I think that most alleged perversions are open to argument.
In matters of content: There's a lot of people who find sex offensive, but there's also a lot of people who find sex natural and religion offensive.
In matters of style: There are people who find rude language rude, and there's people for whom any censoring of language is offensive.
Also, isn't the notion that some words are intrinsically, magically bad ridiculous?
Comment by The Voices in my Head
The Voices in my Head
Everyone is entitled to their opinion. People are entitled to post whatever they like...there just may be consequences for not posting certain material on an adult site rather than one open to all age groups and beliefs.
There are different ways to assert that we disagree. There is no need to lash out. Orble's resident grumpy old man has caused everyone to speak in such an angry manner. There is no reason for it.
Voices~
PS What other blogs have been shut down? God...I haven't been on Voices all day! What if...??
*running*
Comment by Luke
Old Movies
Cane Toad Warrior
It's like politics... a good politician will attack his opponent's argument, whereas a bad one will simply attack his opponent.
What does my 'poor' sight, imagined or otherwise, have to do with the issue at hand here?
Comment by The Voices in my Head
The Voices in my Head
I am going to PM you with a response. This is Katyzzz's post and I don't want to take it over.
Voices~
Comment by Luke
Old Movies
Cane Toad Warrior
Just so we're clear... would this - http://www.canetoadwarrior.com/the-legend-of-jesus/ - be unacceptable too?
Comment by postmoderncritic
Postmodern Critic
Relativity Watch
Padsoc
Katy,
Were you referring to Wordophilia? (It appears to have been removed from the network.)
Comment by Ahmed
Video Gamer Kids
Little Green Foosballs
PolyKicks
I agree with katyzzz that erotica should be censored from orble, heck I probably mean it further than most of you other people here. Not in the name of censorship but in the name of sanity, seriously, when communities start going after erotica in the least it ends up opening floodgates for the rest, if posting about some guy having sex ith a cow attracts traffic it will just lead to copycats, so on and so forth.
I'm not speaking based on opinion, I'm speaking based on experience.
Comment by The Voices in my Head
The Voices in my Head
If we are talking about chopping away at Orble until it suits one or two people's sensitivities...then who will read your posts???
LOL sorry I couldn't resist!
Voices~
Comment by Ahmed
Video Gamer Kids
Little Green Foosballs
PolyKicks
I'm not talking about extremes, if that is what you're thinking then it is quite typical really. Talk about censorship and suddenly were takling stalin russia.
Ironically censorship is happening in a bad way alla round us for things that matter, nobody cares of course if the matter is serious. If it is critics about foreign policies in Iran who are censored people don't give a damn. But when it comes to bare breasts and trash talk, run for the mountains and all the rest, if it is stopped then it's censorship and dictaorship and whatever comes next.
Comment by The Voices in my Head
The Voices in my Head
Typical of what, exactly, Ahmed?
It was a joke. I don't typically think in typical terms.
Voices~
Comment by Bhumika
Political Minds
Comment by katyzzz
Photography Tips
MS Paint Art
Good to see you.
katyzzz
Comment by Bryn
Horrorphile
Horror movies are primarily about the subversion of everthing that is "safe and decent" in the art of cinema ....
I would be horrified if I found my own blog at the dirty hands of censorship ...
Comment by KylieW
Celebrity Obsession
If you don't like it. Don't read it. Just because you don't like it, doesn't mean that others don't.
Comment by katyzzz
Photography Tips
MS Paint Art
And, incidentally, Bryn, and I am not referring to you, defamation, ageism, discrimination, slander are all against the law, internationally, too. And let's not forget dishonesty and justice and don't tell me how 'someone' is so deserving, that's crap, as those word are still permitted.
Don't dump it on me Bryn, I have been more than restrained and tolerant for those with vision who can see it. The choice was yours, you exercised it, don't expect me to take it.
Kylie,
You have missed the point, like so many. The fact is we were forced to watch it and the contents of H's posts knew no bounds in referring to me. Plus read comments to Bryn and take on board what is relevant to you.
You're a nice closed little community, protecting each other.
I'm not going to cop the flack, because I happen to be decent and have enough skills to be able to not rely on the vile to gain attention.
Too many here are too stupid, unfortunately they are the most vocal, the decent ones say nothing because they fear the abuse that has been dumped on me.
You're free to give your opinion, let's make it a factual, well informed one.
katyzzz
Comment by Ahmed
Video Gamer Kids
Little Green Foosballs
PolyKicks
If I say I'm going to have a drink of water it means I'm jumping in a pool, if I say theres a campfire area here it means thers a bushfire, if I say that vulgarity for the sake of vulgar shouldn't be allowed I am a tyranical dictator censoring anything I dislike.
Comment by Hellvis
Earache Hotel
I agree that Orble needs to be cleaned up, but not of so-called filth and profanity.
I feel that there is something far worse than the supposed evils of which you speak, and that includes, but is not exhausted by, the following:
Creative bankruptcy
Paucity of ideas
Prudishness
Cowardice
The irresponsibility of political correctness
Posts about Orble
Don't you think that these things set a far worse example for young people than so-called pornographic material? Aren't inforced moral crutches a form of mind pollution, because they are not arrived at by natural exploration but are handed down by self-imposed leaders drunk on control?
Still, it's not my place to police others' mediocrity, only my own. And sorry for the loaded language, but then again I shouldn't have to aplogise for anything.
You say that paedophiles prosper on the internet, presumably because information and what you call ‘muck’ is free and easily obtained. Perhaps it is that paedophiles are easier to detect on the internet, precisely BECAUSE of this freedom of information. Let's not forget that paedophiles have prospered in the Catholic and many other churches, where sexuality is suppressed, for ages before the internet.
Perhaps, in protecting people from what you do not want them to see, you in fact inhibit their ability to deal with the world, which is full of far greater evils than a few naughty words and images.
I think censorship is hindering the human race's ability to evolve intellectually. Anyone agree?
P.S. I hope you don't perceive this as abuse, but censorship is as offensive to me as 'profanity' is to you.
P.P.S. I do not abuse women in any way (my girlfriend is a steadfast feminist and wouldn't be with me if I did). I am offended by your conflation of taboo language with abuse of women. It cheapens the REAL abuse that has been suffered by myself and several of my loved ones.
Comment by katyzzz
Photography Tips
MS Paint Art
NOW, HELLVIS,
There is so much you have said that is itself debateable. Definitions need to be clear.
The key word you have used is, WANT to. I did not want to, but could not avoid being confronted with it, want to or not, therefore all your reasoning fails.
Despite this you made yourself clear and expressed yourself well, you could be confronted with an army of people who would pull apart many of the statements you have made.
Of this, you are unaware.
But I do appreciate the time, effort and clean language you have used and your opinion was invited so it has every right to be there.
I have no intention of becoming deeply involved in this. It would take for ever and a day. The offensive material has been removed, not as a result of my actions but of the perpetrator's own.
I simply put on a post.
I'm sure there are another things that need attending to but that blog was the prime concern.
Have you heard of the law? One is not permitted to say and do anything one pleases.
My name was bandied around in a most unjust, vile and untruthful, slanderous fashion, for much of the time I was unaware of this.
Yes, we could 'yes, but' all day and I have no intention of going down that path.
Your opinion was invited and you expressed it. I had the right of reply, if somewhat diminished and I bear in mind that there are 'no such blind as those that cannot see'.
katyzzz
Comment by Hellvis
Earache Hotel
Of course much of what I have said is debatable. I am not unaware of this, as you claim. I don't understand why you suggest that I am. I wonder if you are aware that much of what you said is also debatable, but wouldn't want to suggest this because it might be construed as insulting to your intelligence.
Where is this army? Why mention the army? That's rather aggressive. You seem to be suggesting some sort of confrontation and then claim that you don't want to become deeply involved. Why put up a post that is clearly aimed at inviting heated debate and then say you don't want to be involved in that debate?
Clearly there are many deep truths on which I need to be enlightened.
Yes, definitions need do be made clear, as does the nature of the 'filth, depravity and profanity' you mention. Exactly what is it that you are railing against? The very vagueness of your post makes informed discussion impossible (isn't this what censorship is about in the first place?)
Is this about the language used or the fact that you were slandered?
I understand that you were offended by what was said, but maybe this has more to do with the intent of the message than the language used. Incredibly hurtful things can be said with clean language; while joyous, homorous, and heartfelt things can be said with 'profane' language. Let's not confuse the message with the means shall we?
I don't really understand how my reasoning has failed. I have merely put forth some of my ideas on censorship. Please do enlighten me. And no, I've never heard of 'the law'. Are they any good?
P.S. First you attack Luke for his impaired sight and then make some comment about the blind. Is this metaphorical or do you have a problem with those that have less than 20-20 vision?
Comment by Francis
Passionate Apathy
Comment by Luke
Old Movies
Cane Toad Warrior
Comment by Adrian
Philosophy Blog
For no particular reason, I think you all, especially Katy, need to read Norm's non-rude post about the rude parts of computers.
Comment by David my David
Speaking as the spokes-person for the Beat-les?
"We're more popular than Jesus Christ."
[delete] ...
Comment by Anonymous
I will always warn people if something is particully offensive.
So don't try to cramp my style, and I won't cramp yours.
Comment by Philip Sharp
ICONOCLASTEROID
Tokenspark: Super Capsule Tokyo Blast!!!
My idea of an admirable person is someone who can continue to broadcast a clear signal amidst a clamor of other signals which they perceive as noise; altering the other signals is sort of beyond one's scope, isn't it?
Priest or prostitute, I hope you broadcast your signal loud and clear. Either way, each has plenty to learn from the other.
Comment by Alexander Hine
Human, all too human thoughts, raving and dingustalk
Tones and Tremelos; music news and views
Music Toes
All you did in the article was make dogmatic statements about vague offense and the 'feminine mind' wielding infinite power over men's vulgarity.
Are you religious, or of the extreme left? Freedom of speech does mean freedom to abuse, actually...I think this is a stupid post, only a girl would post something like this....
....you see, that was rude...I didn't actually mean it (the girl part) - but if I did, it shouldn't be removed, just argued with - that's how liberty works,
A. Hine
Comment by Alexander Hine
Human, all too human thoughts, raving and dingustalk
Tones and Tremelos; music news and views
Music Toes
Why don't you crawl back under your rock and leave us filthy humans alone, you are obviously of a higher level of consciousness and should not mingle with people who actually believe in the gritty realities of free speech and liberty.
....God I love writing spiteful polemics...
Thanks for the praise for my poem by the way
I'll have to find something of yours I like so I can stop yelling at you
A. Hine